Mysterious (well, slightly) 1st class Nakhimov № 107

[komsomol]

Like this one

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What piece it is (from which collection I mean)?

Strange colors, a photography effect?

[Japanx]

From GIM (State Historical Museum in Moscow), if I remember correctly.
1961 vintage

[Japanx]

Nick, about the robbery hypothesis, two questions come to mind:
- I believed most orders exposed in russian museum - and a fortiori the highest ones - were copies?
- what would do a non-serialised order in a museum? The theory would command that a brand new piece be in a safe at the State mint?

You see, as far as I know there were two types of orders in soviet museums.

First type - is the ordinary orders with erased serial numbers.
Second - specially issued (in early 60s) orders without serial numbers.

Why they decided to issue additional medals and orders for museums after war (especially since there were unissued orders from the old stock) is beyond me ...

[Japanx]

Check this out guys
1st class Nakhimov from collection pof The Pushkin State Museum of Fine Arts.
Unfortunately no reverse, but very HQ picture of obverse

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[Japanx]

These two stars were made for the same museum in 1956 by ЛМД

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[Japanx]

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[Japanx]

These two stars were made for the same museum in 1956 by ЛМД

Well, actiually they were transferred from the Mint to the Museum in 1956.
The actual time of manufacturing is unknown to me.

[Japanx]

This 4th awarding were transferred to the Museum from the Moscow Mint in 1955

22.jpg

[komsomol]

Nick, about the robbery hypothesis, two questions come to mind:
- I believed most orders exposed in russian museum - and a fortiori the highest ones - were copies?
- what would do a non-serialised order in a museum? The theory would command that a brand new piece be in a safe at the State mint?

You see, as far as I know there were two types of orders in soviet museums.

First type - is the ordinary orders with erased serial numbers.
Second - specially issued (in early 60s) orders without serial numbers.

Why they decided to issue additional medals and orders for museums after war (especially since there were unissued orders from the old stock) is beyond me ...

So, in the two cases, the orders were made from preicous metals... LIke the real McCoy...

I ask this because in numerous pics some orders are basic copies (Here in Paris , INvalides, our soviet high orders exposed are sad copies, fairly easy to spot).

[Japanx]

So, in the two cases, the orders were made from preicous metals... LIke the real McCoy...

Yep.
These are not cheap copies, but actual orders only unnumbered (or with erased original numbers), but with mint mark.
You see, some of these were intended for numismatic collections of museums (as we see, they placed them even in numismatic collection of the art museum), others for museum displays.

[Dom]

What has become Order and Medals rendered to the State after the death of the recipient

[Japanx]

Before 1977 awards (after the death of cavalier) were returned to ГОХРАН.
Theoretically they all should be still there

[Dom]

Before 1977 awards (after the death of cavalier) were returned to ГОХРАН.
Theoretically they all should be still there

Both these are always (Zhukov Victory Order presented by his daughter)

победа 6.jpg

победа 7.jpg

And that's just fine

[Japanx]

Let`s hope these are originals

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23.JPG

[komsomol]

So, in the two cases, the orders were made from preicous metals... LIke the real McCoy...

Yep.
These are not cheap copies, but actual orders only unnumbered (or with erased original numbers), but with mint mark.
You see, some of these were intended for numismatic collections of museums (as we see, they placed them even in numismatic collection of the art museum), others for museum displays.

Is it possible to consider the rule is different in Ukraine? (I must find out those poor pictures of the Museum memorial of Kiev, showing nasty copies in the expositions)...

[Japanx]

Is it possible to consider the rule is different in Ukraine? (I must find out those poor pictures of the Museum memorial of Kiev, showing nasty copies in the expositions)...

Original awards of cavaliers were stolen a loooooooooong time ago in Kiev (most likely by the museum workers or at the very least with their help)
They didn't even bother enough to put a nice copies under the glass.
Some cheap crap...

Same story (only on a smaller scale) with Central Museum of Armed Forces in Moscow.
At least 8 original orders were stolen in the 90s. At least officially...

[Japanx]

I must find out those poor pictures of the Museum memorial of Kiev, showing nasty copies in the expositions ...

Here they are

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[Japanx]

44.JPG

45.JPG

Etc, etc, etc ...

[Japanx]

If I remember correctly some of Shaposhnikov awards were missing from Central museum

6.jpg

[SergioV]

Nick, what about this museum, Originals or Repro?

http://www.rkka.it/forum/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=28375

[komsomol]

Well, I had the stupid idea of repeating this story on WH-forum, and I've nearly been told I was a liar...

Since a Kutuzov 1st belonging to marshall Katukov was sold in NYC, we must conclude that every museum in Russia is a sieve...

[Japanx]

Well, I had the stupid idea of repeating this story on WH-forum,

WH?!
Where the heck is this?
Give us a link

[Japanx]

Nick, what about this museum, Originals or Repro?

http://www.rkka.it/forum/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=28375

Lenins, Red banners, October revolutions, foreign awards, etc look like originals.
As for the heavy stuff - impossible to tell anything with certainty by these photos.
I don't like the look of Ushakov and Nakhimov. Could be a museum copies and originals (presumably ) are in the depository.

[komsomol]

Well, I had the stupid idea of repeating this story on WH-forum,

WH?!
Where the heck is this?
Give us a link

http://www.wehrmacht-awards.com/forums/ ... 194&page=5

[Japanx]

Aaaaaaa
WAF

I am not going deeper into this shady topic

Damn